"I am not sure that the terrorists deliberately hit the hospital in Gaza. But it is their responsibility"
Do you understand what to do after the IDF ground operation? What will happen to Gaza?
My view is that this war needs to end when Hamas is no longer the ruler of Gaza. I think Hamas lost its legitimacy to be in control. I think Hamas also lost its legitimacy to be governing a civilian population in Gaza Strip. And the hospital incident is an example for that. They brought a lot of suffering to their own people because of the attack they did on October 7th.
It is important that there is a pursuit for removal of Hamas from living in Gaza. I think Israel needs the support of the international community for that as well. And there are enough more pragmatic forces, Palestinian forces, that should assume responsibility for the people of Gaza. Israel is not at war with the Gazans. It is not at war with the Palestinians. It is at war with Hamas and we will stop them.
So, do you think that the Israeli government has enough evidence to prove its innocence in the attack on Al-Ahli hospital?
Yes, of course. A spokesman for the IDF provided everything that we had, including the terrorists' intercepted conversations. It was something that we rarely do. Everything was put outside and verified.The President of the United States himself said that he trusts the sources after verifying with his own intelligent people. I really don't understand why this is still an open question.
I'm not sure that they would hit their own hospital on purpose. But it doesn't matter. If they shot a rocket and it fell on the hospital and killed so many people, then it's their responsibility and certainly they cannot blame us for doing it.
Some international media today are just looking for an excuse to justify a position that Israel should not be able to defend itself. How can we be responsible for something that we didn't do?
Do you agree that the tragedy in Al-Ahli has changed the situation in the region and now the Arab world – Egypt, Jordan, Qatar – openly opposes the IDF's operation in Gaza?
No, those countries that you've just mentioned, they did not believe that Israel has a right to defend itself from the outset. When the Jordanian Prime Minister, the Jordanian Foreign Minister El-Safadi goes on CNN and says that it doesn't matter what the truth is, Israel will be blamed anyway. How can this be reasonable? They're just looking for excuses.
In your opinion, could this situation escalate into a larger war where Arab countries stand against Israel?
It could. If Nasrallah decides to make a mistake to open war on Israel, then we'll have two fronts. It's completely in his hands. Israel didn't look for the beginning of the war. Israel didn't look even for the first front.
But if Nasrallah decides to do this or Iran decides to send another group to join in, yes, of course, it will escalate to a larger war. But this will not be what Israel is looking for.
Yes, but you are talking about the pro-Iranian forces. What about other Arabic countries? Do you think countries like Egypt or Qatar strictly may do something to prevent an IDF operation in Gaza?
I will say on the contrary. I think that Egypt knows very well that the risk posed to it by Hamas is very, very big. The fact that they do not want Palestinians to come into Sinai is because they don't want Hamas to infiltrate Sinai.
We are not getting a pushback of that magnitude by any of those countries. It's sleep talk. Unfortunately, they are hypocrite because they should have given more support against such atrocities made by Hamas.
I don't think there are any countries that are willing to openly engage in the war against Israel.
So is none of the countries interested in an open war against Israel?
We're not in the 60s and the 70s anymore. Those days are over. Neither Egypt nor Jordan is looking for a war on Israel. And Syria has its own issues and they are not engaging. The only country that can join or not, I mean, it's a terror organization that owns the country, that is Hezbollah in Lebanon. They are the only candidate that can be aggressive as a proxy of Iran against Israel.
It's a major threat and it's very difficult to defend because terror is very difficult to defend, especially when it is state-sponsored by Iran.
Do you think that Iran could start a big-scale war against Israel right now?
If they're able to compel Hezbollah to shooting rockets at the civilian population in Israel, then they could. They will suffer consequences. And I think not only from Israel, because the American president made it very clear what he thinks about that and what is the purpose of the carrier battle group.
If Iran decides to do this mistake, then Israel will need to attack it. I would be very surprised if the Iranian army entered into a direct confrontation with Israel. I think that the consequences for that would be too big for Iran and I don't expect them to do this.
"If Beijing and Moscow had hoped that the war on Israel would play to their benefit, they were wrong"
Is there a possibility of Israel losing this war?
Israel will definitely not lose because we're not in a situation where this can end with Israel losing territories. They're not capable of conquering Israel. A lot of lives have been lost, and we have hostages in Gaza that we need to get back. Historically, this will be a very bloody and hurtful and devastating terrorist blow that Israel got. But in the course of our history, Israel has suffered such terror attacks for decades and decades. So this is not about Israel losing.
Do you think this war is primarily aimed against Israel? Can we say that it is also aimed against the USA?
Like in many conflicts around the world, they're always opportunists who try to piggyback on this.
I think that there are a lot of beneficials of this war whose main goal is to derail the normalization process with Saudi Arabia. Clearly it cannot continue at this point. But eventually it will happen.
If they had hoped that the outcome of this would be less American involvement in the Middle East,
then I think what they're experiencing is exactly the opposite. The Americans' commitment to Israel's security is strong and the immediate response by the American army is visible to everybody.
Can we say that Hamas's attack happened because the world did not want to pay attention to Iran and give it and its allies enough pushback?
It is true unfortunately that since the beginning of 2023, Iran has had a more successful year than previously. Both with Russia and they're selling a lot of oil to China and this gives them revenue. Feeling more confident, Tehran might feel that they can do more. We've seen the results.
By the way, just the other day, the UN resolution restricting Iran's export of ballistic missiles expired...
...Now they can freely trade missiles with the whole world, including Russia. And we have even less chance of stopping them. At the same time, Tehran will also have access to technology and will be able to export it. Israel opposed it and put it on the international agenda many, many times because we knew what would happen if the world did not react – and the world did not react.
The Wall Street Journal said that Russia provided money to Hamas. What are your thoughts on this?
First I think we need to confirm this information. I've seen the report and made inquiries. What I know is that nobody should support terror organizations. This is against all codes. And I hope that we will find that this story wasn't true.
We heard Putin, we heard Medvedev, we heard Maria Zakharova. They clearly spoke against Israel. How do you assess the position of the Russian leadership?
I'm very unhappy to see that Russia does not support Israel when it is clear that we were attacked brutally by a terrorist organization. Unfortunately, Russia did not provide support to Israel on previous occasions as well against terrorism. I think it calls on the Israeli government to evaluate this and to respond.
How would Russia and China benefit from the war on Israel waged by Iran and its proxy?
They get benefits from the fact that the world is distracted and occupied in other regions. But I think they also have what to lose from experiencing the support that Israel is getting from the United States and from the Western countries. President Biden, British Prime Minister Rishi Sunak, and German Chancellor Olaf Scholz have all visited Israel. And I think Ukraine understands very well what it looks like when there is international support, wide international support to the cause. If Beijing and Moscow had hoped that this would play to their benefit, I'm not sure it will play out the way they wanted.
"We need to ensure that Iran and Russia do not benefit from ballistic missile cooperation"
Ukraine has supported Israel, but many of its citizens are left with an unpleasant aftertaste: they don't understand why Israel didn't support them in the same way, didn't help them in their time of need.
I know that there is sometimes a notion or a narrative out there that Israel does not support Ukraine. And I'm very sorry for that, because Israel supports Ukraine very, very strongly. I was a national security advisor when the war started. It was clear to Israel from the outset that Russia was to blame and that Ukraine needed support.
I know that there is criticism on the Ukrainian side that Israel did not provide air defence capabilities to Ukraine. One of the arguments that I mentioned all the time was that if, God forbid, a war began in the Middle East, I was not sure that Israel would have enough means to protect itself. However, we urged the larger countries, the United States and others, to be the ones that take the toll of providing the equipment Ukraine needs.
I did not envision that there would be a war in the Middle East, but now that it has started, it is quite clear that we need the equipment to defend ourselves against such horrific quantities of rockets that have been shot back on us. I think that both the previous government and this government maintain the strong connections with the Ukrainian leadership and support it. And I hope that the Ukrainian people have felt it before and feel it now.
Is the Israeli government ready to join efforts with Kyiv against common enemies?
There are many areas in which we can cooperate. Right now, as I said, we can join forces and demand that the international community stop the proliferation of Iranian ballistic missiles. We need to ensure that Iran and Russia do not benefit from such cooperation. This is a threat that both of our countries feel, and the liberal democratic world should share these concerns. I also believe that Iran's transfer of other weapons and technologies to Russia, which are used against Ukrainians, is a priority for both countries. We must counteract this.
Of course, these are joint efforts in the fight against terrorism and many other things. There are many opportunities for cooperation in the field of intelligence, operational work and diplomacy. It is important to maintain a close dialogue between our law enforcement agencies and coordinate cooperation. We have common interests and must pursue them.
There have been close contacts and collaborations, and they must continue. I think that countries in need should and need to stand together. And I'm very grateful for the support we're getting from Ukraine and from the support we're getting from President Zelenskyy. I think that we have to always continue to look for areas of joint work and collaboration between our countries. This is very important for the peoples of Ukraine and Israel.
What message would you send to the people of Ukraine?
From the depths of my heart, I want to reach out to the Ukrainian people that have been fighting in the war for so long. You do not deserve such aggression and my hope is that there is a way for the war in Ukraine to end soon and favourable for your people. I wish you all the best. Continue to be strong and to give us all such a good demonstration of courage and a strong society.