Let's start with definitions. In Ukraine, you are often referred to as Donald Trump's ‘spiritual advisor,’ although such a concept simply does not exist in your religious tradition. How do you define yourself?
Time magazine called me President Trump's chief pastor. He himself has called me his pastor several times. Most people say spiritual advisor to the president, so ‘spiritual advisor to the president’ is the most accurate description.
During Ukraine's Independence Day celebrations, President Zelenskyy awarded you the Order of the Third Degree, a state award. What does this mean to you?
I accept this award with gratitude and humility, but I don't feel that I really deserve it. After all, so many people are dying right now defending their homeland... I have done nothing compared to those who are on the front lines, shooting down drones and defending the country. There are children who have been kidnapped by Russia and are being reprogrammed.
I don't mean anything bad about the President's decision to give me this award — I'm grateful and touched, it's a great honour, one of the greatest in my life. I never thought I'd be in a situation where I'd be honoured so highly. Even sitting next to the President at breakfast or dinner is incredible.
But, to be honest, I also feel guilty. Because I have done nothing. People are suffering. The real heroes of Ukraine are suffering. And I am sitting here in a beautiful library, and I am outraged why there is still no ceasefire from Putin, that we have still not been able to stop this war.
Do not underestimate your contribution; you have your own instruments of influence, which are very important for Ukraine. Let us discuss them, first of all in terms of religion and politics. What role does religion currently play in US domestic and foreign policy, especially on the part of Republicans?
An extremely strong one. Especially for Republicans, the conservative side, the right wing in America. Evangelical Christians constitute the largest electoral bloc in America. They have great political power. So religion plays a huge role in domestic politics and in foreign policy — when it comes to countries where freedom of religion is restricted.
This is an important point. Because one of the myths was the claim that there is no freedom of religion in Ukraine.
Yes, and as a staunch Republican and Trump supporter, I was initially opposed to helping Ukraine because I was fed the lie that Ukrainians do not allow religious freedom.
How did you realise that this was not true and that you were being misled?
When I came here. It was obvious.
But not all Americans can come to Ukraine. How can we explain to American society that there is no ban on freedom of religion in Ukraine?
My first meeting here was with about 45 religious leaders of different faiths — Jews, Muslims, Baptists, Evangelicals... Everyone was represented. And then I realised: if there is such diversity, the claim that there is no freedom of religion is a lie.
I suspect there were no representatives of the Russian Church?
No, there weren't. Now I understand why. As was explained to me and proven, the Russian Orthodox Church is a continuation of the Kremlin's criminal line. I even said this in my speech: you cannot bless missiles and at the same time call yourself a child of God. This is a cult, using God to justify the killing of innocent people, Ukrainians. This is unacceptable.
And, in fact, one of Vladimir Putin's goals is to establish control through the Russian Orthodox Church.
Yes, among his demands during negotiations with Donald Trump were ‘granting official status to the Russian language’ and ‘restoring the rights of the Russian Church.’
He wants even more control because Ukraine is very religious. And if you control religion, you control people. Ukrainians must not allow this.
Our law prohibits the activities of the Russian Church in the country, and the UOC (MP) falsely insists that it has no connection with it. To be honest, it is not very clear what to do with them. That is, the courts — of course, but ...
We need to use the media to inform society. When Putin announced his demands, I was the first to speak out against them. People need to be aware, we need to launch mass information campaigns on social media and television to explain the atrocities that have been committed, including by the Russian Orthodox Church.
People die because of a lack of knowledge, says the Bible, so I will ‘explode’ on every broadcast, on social media, on television, so that everyone knows what the Russian Orthodox Church, linked to the Kremlin, is doing.
And as soon as the church becomes a political tool, it ceases to be a church. It is just another political weapon used by one country trying to gain control over another.
Therefore, we must inform as many people as possible.
It is paradoxical: Russia has destroyed many churches of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church (Moscow Patriarchate) here in Ukraine, but they continue to emphasise that they are not a Russian church.
And this is a challenge. How not to deprive people of their civil liberties and at the same time protect the nation. We have an internal security service in America. I know you have something similar. And what we do is monitoring. We are not at war with Islam, but there are small fascist groups in the Islamic community that use religion as a cover to carry out terrorist activities in America.
Every day, the FBI's domestic security service detects and stops incidents involving people who hide behind the peaceful faith of Islam to use it for murder and destruction in Western society. We are not declaring war on Islam. We do not prevent people from practising their faith in America, but we have agents across the country whose job is to make sure that people we may be monitoring based on their past activities are not planning anything that will lead to terrorist attacks.
Let's return to the question of American society. How can we explain to the general public that freedom of religion is not being violated in Ukraine? Obviously, they don't think about this every day; they have their own concerns, but still...
Communicate. Show that the Holy Father of the Russian Orthodox Church blesses missiles. I personally received messages about this from Russians, saying that if you kill Ukrainians, it will give you a path to heaven. Such statements cease to be religious. Their use creates religious fanatics who use religion as a way to manipulate people to achieve their goals — terrorism. For me, what is happening in the Russian church is no different from what is happening with religious fanatics in the Islamic community.
All religions can be manipulated. In the 1990s, Christian Timothy McVeigh blew up the Federal Building in Oklahoma in the name of Jesus (a former Marine with right-wing views drove a truck loaded with half a tonne of explosives under the building and blew it up, killing 168 people, including 19 children from a kindergarten on the first floor. McVeigh considered his crime an act of resistance against the government, which, he said, restricted freedom and interfered in people's personal lives. — S.K.). David Koresh in Waco, Texas, burned down his estate along with young children who, in essence, committed suicide in the name of faith (76 people died, including 25 children. — S.K.). Therefore, this is not just about Islam. The Bible was used to justify slavery and the activities of the Ku Klux Klan. So, any faith can be manipulated.
Therefore, what is happening with the Russian Orthodox Church is no different from what terrorists do, and these incidents need to be covered in America.
Why did I ask twice about the importance of explaining to ordinary Americans that there is no religious oppression of Ukrainians? When Congress voted to allocate aid to Ukraine, Robert Amsterdam launched an active campaign in the United States about the alleged oppression of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church (MP), which, unfortunately, became a strong argument against Ukraine.
There is no oppression of religious freedom in Ukraine, and I say this because I am here. The President (Donald Trump — S.K.) calls me his pit bull. And I tend to be straightforward; I don't have time to try to be diplomatic when the truth is at stake.
The reality is that no one is oppressing Ukrainians because of their religion. Why is it important to convey this to Americans? Because it is part of your negotiations. We need public pressure from Americans on their congressmen, which will help in the adoption of foreign policy laws in America.
Will secondary sanctions be imposed on Russia? We must exert pressure that will influence President Trump's decision. Of course, it will ultimately be his decision, but does he know that Ukrainians believe in freedom of religion and that this is why they do not want to have the Russian Church and the Russian language as official, because they consider the Russian Orthodox Church to be a spy organisation that aims to control the free Ukrainian people? If the president or the American public do not know this, it is difficult to pressure the president, why we believe in freedom of religion.
Even countries such as Korea, from which I have recently returned, are dealing with this issue. President Lee met with President Trump at the White House. I cannot say everything, but my stay in Korea had to do with religious freedom and the persecution of several religious organisations. Korea used to have 0% terrorism, now it has 15%. So religion and freedom of religion play a big role.
Therefore, we must ensure that America understands that the partial restriction of the Russian Orthodox Church is not because there is some obstacle to people practising their faith. It is why these are Russian agents who are essentially domestic terrorists, such as the KKK (Ku Klux Klan — S.K.), the Black Panther Party, and dormant Islamic institutions in America.
In May, you stated: ‘Putin will soon find out how things can get worse for Russia. Trump wants to end the war, but Putin is a war criminal who refuses to back down.’ When will this ‘soon’ come?
I believe that the President essentially issued a bilateral ultimatum (at the end of August — S.K.) — he gave him (Putin — S.K.) two weeks, and that is essentially the end.
The President sent two nuclear submarines with nuclear weapons to the region. We are terrorising one of our strategic partners, India, for buying cheap Russian oil. We are going to pass a fairly strong bill in the US Senate on the introduction of secondary sanctions on Russian oil, which will essentially paralyse their economy. Oil accounts for about 35% of their GDP. It is their king. And they are on the verge of financial collapse, as many members of the intelligence community say. If all this is true, they cannot allow secondary sanctions to be imposed. I believe that in the next few weeks you will see either a peace agreement or Putin sitting down at the negotiating table.
Do you really believe in a peace agreement?
One hundred per cent.
But why do you think Putin will stop now? For him, this war is like a religion, it's his idea. Why should a fanatic stop?
You can't control someone as crazy as Putin. We are not warmongers. I don't want war. I want peace. Just like President Trump.
No one wants war.
Some people do. They really do.
I meant no one except Putin.
We don't want war, but we are ready to do everything possible to stop it. Four months ago, you didn't have such support from NATO, from European partners.
That is why America's support is so important now, as President Zelenskyy has said. More than 30 countries have joined the pro-Ukrainian coalition, they are seeking the support of the United States, so America's leadership is absolutely necessary.
I understand the importance of America. And the President understands it. But he also understands the strength and power of Europe and European leaders. And the money, weapons and soldiers they have at their disposal.
Yes, America supports Ukraine 100%. That is why President Trump held a historic meeting in the Oval Office, bringing European leaders to the negotiating table. And this conversation was about what we must do — not just the United States of America, but us as a group around Ukraine, our brother, our sister country — what we must do to support Ukraine in its confrontation with tyranny. And you are beginning to see this happening.
I consider it a blessing that Ukraine is not alone, because it is not easy. But the president wanted people to know that he supports Ukraine. He is with Ukraine. And he is trying with all his might to prevent World War III. This is entirely possible. No one knows the state of Vladimir Putin's stability, and he has nuclear weapons.
I don't think nuclear weapons are an argument in this situation.
Do you think so?
I think so. Last question: would you advise Mr. Trump to visit Ukraine in the near future? President Zelenskyy has invited him I don't know how many times.
Absolutely. I have already advised him to do so.
But, to be honest, the President does not need to be persuaded any more than he already is. His visit to Ukraine is unlikely to have any impact. What will have an impact is Putin sitting down at the negotiating table. And if he does not, we will continue to arm Ukraine in the air and on the ground. You will have weapons to shoot down drones; even more powerful drones to attack the enemy. You will start bombing with serious bombs in response to their shelling. In the end, Putin will want to sit down at the negotiating table.
Do you think Donald Trump's visit will take place before or after our victory?
I cannot speak for the President, he is very unpredictable. You never know for sure. What I can say is that General Kellogg is here, I am here, people close to the President are here, and this is a sign for the Ukrainian people. Although, I must remind you, I was initially against supporting Ukraine.
Now polls show that more and more Republicans support Ukraine. This is no longer a question for Democrats. It is 100% recognition that Vladimir Putin is evil and he is not going to stop at Ukraine. He is going to attack Moldova and two other states that can activate Article 5 (NATO. — S.K.). We are at war at the highest level. So either we stop Vladimir Putin at the Ukrainian border, or we will have to stop him in some other country. But it is better to stop him now.
